Manchester United and Man City are both enduring rough starts to the 2023/24 Premier League season and things don't seem to be stopping anytime soon.
United wanted to at least challenge for the Champions League spots but find themselves in eighth at the moment and eight points back. Meanwhile, reigning champions City are down in fifth and six points behind leaders Arsenal, though the Blues do have a game in hand.
City did win the Club World Cup this week so it's not all doom and gloom. United, however, are finding new ways to underwhelm. VAR has been a massive talking point once again this season and there are some changes to the standings in this league without VAR. Let's take a look.
13. Newcastle United
Points Without VAR: 29 Difference: 0 | AFP via Getty Images
14. West Ham United
Points Without VAR: 30 Difference: 0 | Liverpool FC via Getty Images
15. Brighton and Hove Albion
Points Without VAR: 31 Difference: +1 Photo: Photo by Eddie Keogh/Getty Images
16. Tottenham Hotspur
Points Without VAR: 34 Difference: -2 | Getty Images